FDA has approved the NOVAVAX vaccine today July 13, 2022 - Protein-based Vaccine

[eytonxav]

The lack of durable immunity seems to be a real limitation of the mRNA vaccines so far.

It will be interesting to see whether the Novavax does better. Marching the whole population in for vaccination every six months with a booster is simply unrealistic.

It seems even if you catch Covid, the natural immunity does not seem to be that much better than vac'd immunity, at least I have not seen much data to indicate it is. DW and I have been fully vaccinated, but with only one booster. We have held off on the 2nd booster as we've seen friends who are fully vaccinated coming down with these new BA variants, some multiple times, so we were hoping that a more targeted shot would be available by September. We are thinking since Covid seems to be spiking again that we should get the 2nd booster, but are unsure if it makes sense.

 

[martyp]

It seems even if you catch Covid, the natural immunity does not seem to be that much better than vac'd immunity, at least I have not seen much data to indicate it is. DW and I have been fully vaccinated, but with only one booster. We have held off on the 2nd booster as we've seen friends who are fully vaccinated coming down with these new BA variants, some multiple times, so we were hoping that a more targeted shot would be available by September. We are thinking since Covid seems to be spiking again that we should get the 2nd booster, but are unsure if it makes sense.

I was thinking the same as you and then caught a mild case of Covid a couple of weeks ago and now that decision about updated boosters has been push off for a while.

 

[Alan]

A little bump in the road.

https://www.reuters.com/business/he...side-effect-novavax-covid-vaccine-2022-07-14/

July 14 (Reuters) - The European Medicines Agency on Thursday identified severe allergic reactions as potential side effects of Novavax Inc's (NVAX.O) COVID-19 vaccine.

The vaccine was authorized by U.S. regulators on Wednesday, and its product label in the United States warns against administering the shot to people with a history of allergic reactions to any components of the shot.

Shares of Novavax fell 20.3% to $55.72 in morning trading, along with the broader market and other COVID-19 vaccine makers. Novavax shares are usually volatile.

 

[Scuba]

It seems even if you catch Covid, the natural immunity does not seem to be that much better than vac'd immunity, at least I have not seen much data to indicate it is. DW and I have been fully vaccinated, but with only one booster. We have held off on the 2nd booster as we've seen friends who are fully vaccinated coming down with these new BA variants, some multiple times, so we were hoping that a more targeted shot would be available by September. We are thinking since Covid seems to be spiking again that we should get the 2nd booster, but are unsure if it makes sense.

The 2nd booster doesn’t protect against current Omicron strains, as I understand it.

 

[eytonxav]

The 2nd booster doesn’t protect against current Omicron strains, as I understand it.

That seems to be the case, so we will probably hold off until more variant specific vaccine becomes available. I also understand that when treating with Paxlovid, those who take a statin need to stop taking the statin during treatment. There must be some interaction between drugs or some other reason this is necessary.

 

[explanade]

Doesn't prevent infection from Omicron but reduces risk of death.

 

[harllee]

I believe the Novavax does not use polyethylene glycol (PEGs) so people who are allergic to PEGs and couldn’t get the other vaccines will benefit from this one.
I know one poster on this forum said that they had family members affected by PEG allergies.

I have a PEG allergy but went ahead and took the Moderna vaccine (4 doses) with no problem. My doctor said that Moderna (and Pfizer) did not have enough PEG in them to cause an allergic reaction and he was right. But if I so much as touch hand sanitizer with PEG (and many hand sanitizers do have PEG) I break out in hives.

 

[Chuckanut]

Novavax. FWIW, it has not been approved as a booster. It's approval is currently emergency approval for two doses.

What is good about it is that it can be stored in normal vaccine fridges. That should make it easier to administer in countries that do not have the infrastructure to transport and store vaccines at extremely cold temperatures.

 

[JBTX]

The lack of durable immunity seems to be a real limitation of the mRNA vaccines so far.

It will be interesting to see whether the Novavax does better. Marching the whole population in for vaccination every six months with a booster is simply unrealistic.

If you are talking about short term antibody immunity, no vaccine provides long term antibody immunity. Antibodies begin to phase out months after infection / vaccination by design, because if your bodies stories all the antibodies to everything we have ever been infected with out blood would be literal sludge.

What the body does do is create longer term memory T cells and other long term defenses. These can last for years. These are what is protecting against severe disease and death with Covid vaccination/natural immunity. These longer term defenses usually take 4-5 days to kick in.

What makes Covid, as well as the flu different from all those other diseases that we were vaccinated against as a child is that Covid and the flu tend to incubate between 3-5 days. I think omicron is 3 or less. That incubation is faster than the bodies long term defenses that take 4-5 days. All of those other diseases, like measles, etc take typically 10 days or more to incubate. So the bodies long term defenses via vaccine or natural immunity kick in before disease incubation and prevent follow on infection. With Covid and flu at 3-4 days they beat the long term defenses, thus allowing infection, but they kick in soon enough to prevent severe disease for most people.

So the difference is mainly the disease not the vaccine. It is unlikely that any vaccine that relies on the bodies long term defenses is going to be able to prevent long term flu or Covid infection.

 

[martyp]

There is a nice review of the. Novavax vaccine on the MedCram YouTube channel. The basic message is the efficacy is good but based on pre-Delta variants. There were also some myocarditis cases mostly in young people.

 

[JBTX]

If you are talking about short term antibody immunity, no vaccine provides long term antibody immunity. Antibodies begin to phase out months after infection / vaccination by design, because if your body stores all the antibodies to everything we have ever been infected with our blood would be literal sludge.

What the body does do is create longer term memory T cells and other long term defenses. These can last for years. These are what is protecting against severe disease and death with Covid vaccination/natural immunity. These longer term defenses usually take 4-5 days to kick in.

What makes Covid, as well as the flu different from all those other diseases that we were vaccinated against as a child is that Covid and the flu tend to incubate between 3-5 days. I think omicron is 3 days or less. That incubation is faster than the body’s long term defenses that take 4-5 days. All of those other diseases, like measles, etc take typically 10 days or more to incubate. So the body’s long term defenses via vaccine or natural immunity kick in before disease incubation and prevent follow on infection. With Covid and flu at 3-4 days they beat the long term defenses, thus allowing infection, but they kick in soon enough to prevent severe disease for most people.

So the difference is mainly the disease not the vaccine. It is unlikely that any vaccine that relies on the body’s long term defenses is going to be able to prevent long term flu or Covid infection.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2021/08/americans-are-losing-sight-endgame/619916/

Just to follow this up, the article above is where I got this explanation regarding Covid, vaccines, antibodies, T cells, memory cells etc. If you can’t view it try it in privacy mode.

 

[Shardo]

Still not interested in the vax, had covid twice with nothing but a runny nose to show for it.

 

[Teacher Terry]

I am starting to wonder if most people need boosters because vaccinated people may have protection from dying from the previous vaccines. The protection from actually getting the virus is so short lived.

 

[explanade]

Boosters also add protection vs. death.

Israeli data on 4th booster is pretty clear.

The hope is that second generation vaccines, including nasal vaccines, might have a better chance of stopping infections, even against Omicron.

Boosters helped prevent infection against all variants before Omicron.

 

[JBTX]

I am starting to wonder if most people need boosters because vaccinated people may have protection from dying from the previous vaccines. The protection from actually getting the virus is so short lived.

I don’t think it is terribly clear beyond the third dose for people who are not older or in higher risk groups. Does the booster give you stronger long term immunity after the antibodies fade away? In my case I’d rather be safe than sorry but I’m not rushing to 4th dose my 18 year old.

 

[Teacher Terry]

I have had 3 doses of the vaccine and then had Covid in June so I am not going to worry about it for a year and then see what the latest research shows. I realize that we are still learning as we go. I get really sick for 4 days every time I take the vaccine. Actually I was sicker than when I got Covid. Of course if new variants end up being not mild like the original ones I will be singing a different tune).

 

[Planner]

Recent statement from Dr. Birx:
I knew these vaccines were not going to protect against infection. And I think we overplayed the vaccines, and it made people then worry that it's not going to protect against severe disease and hospitalization. It will. But let's be very clear: 50% of the people who died from the Omicron surge were older, vaccinated. So that's why I'm saying even if you're vaccinated and boosted, if you're unvaccinated right now, the key is testing and Paxlovid. It's effective. It's a great antiviral. And really, that is what's going to save your lives right now if you're over 70, which if you look at the hospitalizations, hospitalizations are rising steadily with new admissions, particularly in those over 70. And so if you live in the South - I know people keep talking about the fall - I'm worried about the South.

 

[Al in Ohio]

Recent statement from Dr. Birx:
I knew these vaccines were not going to protect against infection. And I think we overplayed the vaccines, and it made people then worry that it's not going to protect against severe disease and hospitalization. It will. But let's be very clear: 50% of the people who died from the Omicron surge were older, vaccinated. So that's why I'm saying even if you're vaccinated and boosted, if you're unvaccinated right now, the key is testing and Paxlovid. It's effective. It's a great antiviral. And really, that is what's going to save your lives right now if you're over 70, which if you look at the hospitalizations, hospitalizations are rising steadily with new admissions, particularly in those over 70. And so if you live in the South - I know people keep talking about the fall - I'm worried about the South.

Can you state your source? I searched and cannot find it anywhere.

 

[JBTX]

Can you state your source? I searched and cannot find it anywhere.

https://www.foxnews.com/media/dr-deborah-birx-knew-covid-vaccines-not-protect-against-infection.amp